VR4 Aus Spec Manifold on an EVO motor

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JSTYLE

I AM THEEE DYNO QUEEN!
Joined
Mar 29, 2005
Messages
4,565
Location
Melbourne, Australia
Im thinking about doing this to see if it actually would help to have more aflow go into the motor!

In theory more air flow = more speed = more power...
tho the evo ports arent as big as the vr4.. so i would assume it would make a difference but not as much as it does on a vr4..

anyways ill keep you posted on this theory and how it works.

Jon
 
I did alot of research on inlet manifolds for EVO's recently, also on the actual port sizes and head differences.

From my findings, I'm sure some people will try and say otherwise, but hey, I ask you to prove me wrong.

EVO small port heads, have more hp potential, and better torque spread than the big port VR4 heads.

The Inlet manifold on the EVO, is much better suited to making torque at all rpm due to the simple issue of air velocity.

Not going to go into specifics, but lets just say, new evo's run identical port sizes, with near identical inlet manifold(reversed side for throttle body). People have been able to achieve huge hp with the stock head/manifold on both the early and late model EVO's.

While saying that, there is alot to gain by a well designed custom inlet manifold. The only thing to decide is if this is worth the cost vs performance gain, or are there better alternatives to making hp.

I recently witnessed a friends EVO 2, with forged internals, headwork, cams, stock inlet manifold, stock turbo with 20g comp wheel, standard cooler, upgraded pipework, 3" exhaust and autronic pull just under 250kw@wheels(on pump fuel and 21psi). This car and engine setup to me, is probably the best street setup I've ever driven. Almost stock boost response, yet the power to spin all 4 wheels through 1st, 2nd and 3rd gear. I actually thought it had more power til it was on the dyno, where it actually is just a torque monster, and drops off a lil in the top end, but hey, like I said, perfect street engine.

Sorry for going off topic there a bit Jon, but yeah, just pointing out what I think would be better mods in order to gain hp.
 
Won't you have to add material to the vr4 intake runners so that they match the ports? I have seen this done using fibreglass resin before, but not on a turboed car.
 
Hey,

Well i have:

- Stock Motor
- Stock Turbo
- HKS 264 Camshafts
- Stock inlet manifold
- Upgraded piping 2.5'/2'
- 3' Turboback exhaust
- Stock ECU with chip
- Walbro Pump

Result: 187.3kw and a 12.44 @ 112mph.

Im going to go head with the install of the inlet manifold.. im pretty sure that it should improve my times. Ill run it next week with the new manifold installed, ill get it dyno'd prior to that tho.

I believe that the extra air it will be capable of will improve the air speed.. and more air speed = more power..

Anyways its a 'free' mod so ill see if it works.

Jon
 
Will the VR4 throttle body bolt straight up to the EVO intake manifold without having to match port?
 
i dont think you will see any gains, perhaps a loss of mid range torque?

will be interesting to see anyways, good luck :wink:
 
JSTYLE said:
Hey,

Well i have:

- Stock Motor
- Stock Turbo
- HKS 264 Camshafts
- Stock inlet manifold
- Upgraded piping 2.5'/2'
- 3' Turboback exhaust
- Stock ECU with chip
- Walbro Pump

Result: 187.3kw and a 12.44 @ 112mph.

Im going to go head with the install of the inlet manifold.. im pretty sure that it should improve my times. Ill run it next week with the new manifold installed, ill get it dyno'd prior to that tho.

I believe that the extra air it will be capable of will improve the air speed.. and more air speed = more power..

Anyways its a 'free' mod so ill see if it works.

Jon
Jon

Unless you modify the runners of the inlet manifold, the ports simply wont line up.

There will be no air speed improvement, from changing to larger runners, and plenum volume. Which by the way, you will probably find the evo's internal volume is the same if not larger than the VR4 one.

Air speed and the angle at which the air hits the port and more importantly the angle behind the valve is the most critical factor in making hp than simple airflow. The highest airspeed, at the required flow rate is what will give you the most hp. Ask anyone who is knowledgable about cylinder head porting and how many times they have had to fill up ports where inexperienced porting has gone too large.

Give it a go, but I think its a waste of time.
 
Jon, I would like to see you do it, cause then at least, someone will have actually done it and you will definately know the result. At the moment, we are all speculating. So do it anyway and please let us know the outcomes.
 
CLuTZ said:
runuts said:
Give it a go, but I think its a waste of time.

So do I. If it works, then there'd be alot more people using VR4 intake manifolds on their EVO's. Simple really.

same here............................ :? alot of people in the states revert to an Aspec/USspec intake manifold becasue of better flow characteristics ONCE they have been ported BUT they only use them on 1G engines.
 
rob323 said:
Jon, I would like to see you do it, cause then at least, someone will have actually done it and you will definately know the result. At the moment, we are all speculating. So do it anyway and please let us know the outcomes.

the last time I saw a VR4 intake manifold on an EVO engine was maccavr4's car at errols, the engine needed to be rebuilt.

So yeah, it has been done- not very well because there was tons of non meter'd air coming in through the leaking intake which = mass detonation!
 
GSRSOL said:
CLuTZ said:
runuts said:
Give it a go, but I think its a waste of time.

So do I. If it works, then there'd be alot more people using VR4 intake manifolds on their EVO's. Simple really.

same here............................ :? alot of people in the states revert to an Aspec/USspec intake manifold becasue of better flow characteristics ONCE they have been ported BUT they only use them on 1G engines.

Alot of people have done it in the states, that is for sure. They put the 1G manifold (some identical to VR4's), on 2G(virtually evo) heads, with good results. But you must remember that they never got the evo manifold in the US. Baschur racing themselves said the best all round performing manifold is the EVO 3 intake.

By all means, give it a go, but I think you will find it does nothing more than lose midrange.
 
If i thought i was wasting my time i wouldnt do it.. in regards to it wont line up.. there are tricks to make it work.. as with anything there are ways and 'secrets' to make it all run smooth.

Results will be available in 2 weeks (dyno)

Jon
 
Heres a quote by a dude I know here in NZ. This guy went as far to building his own flowbench for the build of his engine. Posts as 'agent orange' on MMC forums. (Knows his ****)

Fact: A VR4 and Evo head when compared on a flowbench by themselves will show the VR4 as flowing more air. (air flowing into the ports at the manifold face with plasticine bellmouth)
However if you test them with their respective manifolds attached, the Evo head will flow better. (A far more relevant test)
Flowbench testing also does not measure the additional advantage of higher port velocity with the Evo head.

Relevant part in bold. By that we can assue the Evo manifolds flow rates are superior to a VR-4s (Same goes for the people who put n/a 4G63 manifolds on too) Dirk managed over 280kWs at the wheels with the stock manifold in place on his evo aswell. If thats not good enough you might aswell be going for an aftermarket jobbie.
 
CLuTZ said:
rob323 said:
Jon, I would like to see you do it, cause then at least, someone will have actually done it and you will definately know the result. At the moment, we are all speculating. So do it anyway and please let us know the outcomes.

the last time I saw a VR4 intake manifold on an EVO engine was maccavr4's car at errols, the engine needed to be rebuilt.

So yeah, it has been done- not very well because there was tons of non meter'd air coming in through the leaking intake which = mass detonation!

i was reading this thread and almost crying dont do it dre is correct lol my engine dyed in the arse real fast lol :lol:
 
Jon you could weld 5mm thick floors into a n/a vr4 inlet mani & lower the
2g head floor by 5mm to match the inlet mani. Sounds easy, cause it is !
 
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