4G63T Auto to maual conversion, Need help :(

[EVO-00X]

Yeah the Lancers have a seperate ECU for the auto transmission as well and it lives on a metal plate bolted to the floor/firewall behind the cigarette lighter and under the fan box - real bitch of a spot :lol: . Thing is the auto wiring looms are made to suit the extra ECU and it can get pretty confusing very quickly once someone tries to rewire them. Best to just keep it plain and simple and grab a manual engine loom and ECU for sure - no headfuks or bandaid solutions so to speak. As far as differences between Auto and Manual ECU's in the passenger side kick panel are concerned I'll leave that for the ECU experts to explain as I've only ever sourced manual engine looms with ECU's.

 

[FiEND]

Not necessarily mate, I used the Auto VR4 ECU which came out of the half-cut I used to get my 2.0 which I mated it up to a manual transmission. My mate actually thought the auto ECU made the car a little more aggressive, as he had a manual VR4 ECU in his car hooked upto basically the same engine. I hadn't driven his car enough to really notice any difference personally.

And how did you get the ecu to think it's in park / drive ?

 

[FiEND]

Quick update .. .
WEnt to the wreckers, found a loom, got all excited ..etc. took me a good 3hrs to get the wiring out without cutting anything out of the loom, etc. making sure i remember where things go .etc. came back to read the post again, realised i needed loom from 4G93P. Loom i got was out of 4G92P.

So .. how do i change the 2 to a 3 ? :roll:

Ugh .. Gonna try and find another loom i guess .

Btw: Anyone got a spare loom around ? Fo cheap ? lol .

 

[JSTYLE]

Quick update .. .
WEnt to the wreckers, found a loom, got all excited ..etc. took me a good 3hrs to get the wiring out without cutting anything out of the loom, etc. making sure i remember where things go .etc. came back to read the post again, realised i needed loom from 4G93P. Loom i got was out of 4G92P.

So .. how do i change the 2 to a 3 ? :roll:

Ugh .. Gonna try and find another loom i guess .

Btw: Anyone got a spare loom around ? Fo cheap ? lol .

i got an evo loom.. check your private messages!

Jon

 

[EVO-00X]

Hey Fiend, maybe you should hook up with Jon (JSTYLE) and get his help with your conversion as you both live in Melbourne It's a pretty straightforward job.

 

[CLuTZ]

What pedal box are you going to use?

 

[CLuTZ]

I take this back:

Don't mean to rain on your parade, but its heaps easier (and wayy cheaper) to buy one already done or OEM DOHC turbo......

I didn't read this:

My current setup is fwd / manual.

I thought you were trying to convert an AUTO lancer to manual 4G63T

4G63T Auto to maual conversion, Need help

I'm about to go through the same thing, but with an auto RVR 4G63T into a Manual RVR 4G63. You will need to remove the spigot bearing from the crank, and get some proper 4G63 flywheel bolts.

As for the loom, I know that the wiring for the C.A.S is different, as the RVR's have the C.A.S's on the cam gear, instead of the normal spot. I'm with the others though, best bet is to start fresh with a manual loom. you should still be able to use the auto ECU though. Have you figured out if you can chip it yet??

 

[FiEND]

I'm about to go through the same thing, but with an auto RVR 4G63T into a Manual RVR 4G63. You will need to remove the spigot bearing from the crank, and get some proper 4G63 flywheel bolts.

As for the loom, I know that the wiring for the C.A.S is different, as the RVR's have the C.A.S's on the cam gear, instead of the normal spot. I'm with the others though, best bet is to start fresh with a manual loom. you should still be able to use the auto ECU though. Have you figured out if you can chip it yet??

Ahem .. and why am i removing the spigot bearing ? :?

Did you end up finding an rvr loom ? If so how much ? source ?

I haven't really played with the engine, i've just been getting parts that i needed for the conversion, prior to starting, hence the questions. :wink:

 

[CLuTZ]

I'm about to go through the same thing, but with an auto RVR 4G63T into a Manual RVR 4G63. You will need to remove the spigot bearing from the crank, and get some proper 4G63 flywheel bolts.

As for the loom, I know that the wiring for the C.A.S is different, as the RVR's have the C.A.S's on the cam gear, instead of the normal spot. I'm with the others though, best bet is to start fresh with a manual loom. you should still be able to use the auto ECU though. Have you figured out if you can chip it yet??

Ahem .. and why am i removing the spigot bearing ? :?

Did you end up finding an rvr loom ? If so how much ? source ?

I haven't really played with the engine, i've just been getting parts that i needed for the conversion, prior to starting, hence the questions. :wink:

I'm going to use the N/A loom thats already in there. The 7-bolt RVR 4G63 N/A has a 609 AFM stock, which is a bonus. Off the top of my head, I will need knock sensor wiring, and the rest i'll play by ear.

There's a bearing inside the crank which comes out in the auto's which needs to be removed- I had the same issue with a GGSR that I bought which had an auto VR4 motor in it.

Here's a pic of it on an R31 crank:

Here's a write up how to remove it:

http://wiki.r31skylineclub.com/index.php?title=Spigot_bearing_removal

 

[JSTYLE]

I'm about to go through the same thing, but with an auto RVR 4G63T into a Manual RVR 4G63. You will need to remove the spigot bearing from the crank, and get some proper 4G63 flywheel bolts.

As for the loom, I know that the wiring for the C.A.S is different, as the RVR's have the C.A.S's on the cam gear, instead of the normal spot. I'm with the others though, best bet is to start fresh with a manual loom. you should still be able to use the auto ECU though. Have you figured out if you can chip it yet??

Ahem .. and why am i removing the spigot bearing ? :?

Did you end up finding an rvr loom ? If so how much ? source ?

I haven't really played with the engine, i've just been getting parts that i needed for the conversion, prior to starting, hence the questions. :wink:

yer you have to remove the spigot bearing!

Dre, the spigot bearings are dif in a 4G63 compared to a RB30.. not sure if the technique they used on the skyline forums can be used.. i just used a chisel and a die grinder.,. took about 10mins to get rid of it.

and Fiend... you are better off to start with an uncut 4G63T loom.. u can use the 4G93T loom but they are a dime in a dozen to get aswell.

otherwise you will need to do what dre is doing.. bolting up an na loom and putting the missing pieces in (knock sensor wiring, cas wiring (plug type) etc..).. could b hard could b easy.. never done it that way before cos i like things straight forward hence the 4G63T loom.

Jon

 

[FiEND]

I'm going to use the N/A loom thats already in there. The 7-bolt RVR 4G63 N/A has a 609 AFM stock, which is a bonus. Off the top of my head, I will need knock sensor wiring, and the rest i'll play by ear.

I can get a 4G63 N/A Manual loom out of a GSR Galant (93) will this be any good to me ?

Anyone know what extra sensors the turbo version of the loom has ? wiring diagrams ?

There's a bearing inside the crank which comes out in the auto's which needs to be removed- I had the same issue with a GGSR that I bought which had an auto VR4 motor in it.

Here's a write up how to remove it:

http://wiki.r31skylineclub.com/index.php?title=Spigot_bearing_removal

What will this bearing interfere with during the conversion?
Why am i removing it for ?
Won't be able to bolt the gearbox on?
Just trying to work out why it needs to come out .

Thanks again for links / info.

 

[CLuTZ]

I'm going to use the N/A loom thats already in there. The 7-bolt RVR 4G63 N/A has a 609 AFM stock, which is a bonus. Off the top of my head, I will need knock sensor wiring, and the rest i'll play by ear.

I can get a 4G63 N/A Manual loom out of a GSR Galant (93) will this be any good to me ?

Anyone know what extra sensors the turbo version of the loom has ? wiring diagrams ?

There's a bearing inside the crank which comes out in the auto's which needs to be removed- I had the same issue with a GGSR that I bought which had an auto VR4 motor in it.

Here's a write up how to remove it:

http://wiki.r31skylineclub.com/index.php?title=Spigot_bearing_removal

What will this bearing interfere with during the conversion?
Why am i removing it for ?
Won't be able to bolt the gearbox on?
Just trying to work out why it needs to come out .

Thanks again for links / info.

Galants gave different pinouts, so you wont be able to use the ECU you have. You will need one like what EVO-00X said to use. Didn't JSTYLE already say he had one??

Spigot bearing- i'd say its because of different output shaft sizes between the auto and manual.

Anyone know what extra sensors the turbo version of the loom has ? wiring diagrams ?

EVO 1-3 manual and supplements:

http://rs242.rapidshare.com/files/63240936/E_1-3.rar

If you are going to use a N/A lancer loom, then you will have to wire up a knock sensor and IIRC there are 2 wires for the 609 AFM- 5 wire plug for the N/A AFM plug compared to 7 for the turbo.

There are 2 ways you can go about the C.A.S wiring: re-wire the RVR's cam gear C.A.S to suit the loom you have, or do a C.A.S swap, to the other end (where they usually are on these cars)

http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/articles-electrical-wiring/289870-installing-1g-cas-2g.html

I am going to do the conversion, as my N/A RVR has the C.A.S in the normal spot, so less wiring to do (and easier to advance the timing if I can) :wink: :wink:

 

[FiEND]

I am going to do the conversion, as my N/A RVR has the C.A.S in the normal spot, so less wiring to do (and easier to advance the timing if I can) :wink: :wink:

Umm .. can i come watch ? lol ..

Was also thinking .. since the auto has it's own ecu, i'm thinking it's the auto ecu which forbids the car from starting if the tranny is in gear other than park / neutral.

So technically the engine will run / start etc if the auto ecu isn't plug in? Unless a missing gearbox ecu won't even let the engine start at all.

I could get around this by simply leaving the wiring to the starter motor from the current loom. Or am i getting ahead of myself here ? :|

THanks for the link / manual. Going through it now.

 

[JSTYLE]

I am going to do the conversion, as my N/A RVR has the C.A.S in the normal spot, so less wiring to do (and easier to advance the timing if I can) :wink: :wink:

Umm .. can i come watch ? lol ..

Was also thinking .. since the auto has it's own ecu, i'm thinking it's the auto ecu which forbids the car from starting if the tranny is in gear other than park / neutral.

So technically the engine will run / start etc if the auto ecu isn't plug in? Unless a missing gearbox ecu won't even let the engine start at all.

I could get around this by simply leaving the wiring to the starter motor from the current loom. Or am i getting ahead of myself here ? :|

THanks for the link / manual. Going through it now.

ok dont take this the wrong way.. its all good to learn while your doing things along the way.. but what you are going to try an attempt isnt really something i would recommend for someone who doesnt know much about the motor and running gear (no offence intended here).

firstly.. yes you will need to remove the spigot bearing because this spigot bearing acts an an input for the auto converter to bolt onto. you cannot put a flywheel on with this spigot bearing in place! been there done that.

secondly.. you will need an evo loom 4g63t or rvr loom.. they both run similiar plugged ecu. im not a wiring guru so i cant really help you with what you wanna do, ie.. re-wire an na into a turbo... (dre's conversion is pretty straight forward cos it runs the cas.. hence why i think he is running the na loom)

forget about unplugging the auto ecu.. just take it all out at once.. less wiring the better it is..

keep it simple.... you may be on a budget but if you buy say a cheap loom you could spend up to 20hrs rewiring everyuthing for it to start properly! im not trying to sell you my evo loom just telling you how it is.. im sure alot of the guys here will agree with me..

going from auto na to manual turbocharged isnt the easiest thing if you have not done it before... alot of things to watch out for.

Jon

 

[EVO-00X]

You can see why sometimes people say, 'just go and buy a frontcut' and as you take something off the frontcut, put it into your own car in the exact same place. It makes PERFECT sense for beginners to do exactly just this. This way you work on your own car and learn how it all pieces together. As a beginner getting into modifications, rewiring, chopping and changing parts from various models or transmissions, you can end up spending twice as much time and money due to confusion and not knowing what to do. A frontcut is the best way to go for sure and if you can sell what you currently have to make some $$ back to offset your expenditure up to date, you'll already be better off IMO. With a frontcut your car will get back on the road sooner rather than later and you have everything you need to make the car work properly at no extra cost or hassle (except fluids and mating up the exhaust) :wink: Hey, you even get guards, bonnet, brakes, intercooler and piping, gearbox, clutch, headlights, aircon, radiator, basically lots of spares or extra goodies you can probably resell to make some money back

 

[FiEND]

ok dont take this the wrong way.. its all good to learn while your doing things along the way.. but what you are going to try an attempt isnt really something i would recommend for someone who doesnt know much about the motor and running gear (no offence intended here).

None taken. i'm here to learn along the way, always wanted to try converting at least one car. Engine on the lancer was showing some signs of aging, figured why not give it a go. And that's why I'm here.

firstly.. yes you will need to remove the spigot bearing because this spigot bearing acts an an input for the auto converter to bolt onto. you cannot put a flywheel on with this spigot bearing in place! been there done that.

Ok, so it's fair to say that the spigot bearing acts as a converter (reduce diameter) pending on the transmission that was used on the assembly line.

secondly.. you will need an evo loom 4g63t or rvr loom.. they both run similiar plugged ecu. im not a wiring guru so i cant really help you with what you wanna do, ie.. re-wire an na into a turbo... (dre's conversion is pretty straight forward cos it runs the cas.. hence why i think he is running the na loom)

forget about unplugging the auto ecu.. just take it all out at once.. less wiring the better it is..

keep it simple.... you may be on a budget but if you buy say a cheap loom you could spend up to 20hrs rewiring everyuthing for it to start properly! im not trying to sell you my evo loom just telling you how it is.. im sure alot of the guys here will agree with me..

I get what you're saying .. however since evo / rvr manual looms are proving hard / expensive to get, i just wanted to know if and how i can utilize the auto loom / ecu i have. I do believe what youre saying since you've been there done that, i'm merely fishing for alternative answers, don't by any means take it as an insult that i'm not following what you're recommending at this stage. Eventually i probably will, however at this point i'm trying not to spend another $300+ for manual loom/ecu.

going from auto na to manual turbocharged isnt the easiest thing if you have not done it before... alot of things to watch out for.

Jon

Going from a manual 4G93 to manual 4G63T, the loom/ecu for the 63 is just auto ..

Just clarifying ..

Thanks again for info tho. Great to see people contributing .

 

[FiEND]

You can see why sometimes people say, 'just go and buy a frontcut' and as you take something off the frontcut, put it into your own car in the exact same place. It makes PERFECT sense for beginners to do exactly just this. This way you work on your own car and learn how it all pieces together. As a beginner getting into modifications, rewiring, chopping and changing parts from various models or transmissions, you can end up spending twice as much time and money due to confusion and not knowing what to do. A frontcut is the best way to go for sure and if you can sell what you currently have to make some $$ back to offset your expenditure up to date, you'll already be better off IMO. With a frontcut your car will get back on the road sooner rather than later and you have everything you need to make the car work properly at no extra cost or hassle (except fluids and mating up the exhaust) :wink: Hey, you even get guards, bonnet, brakes, intercooler and piping, gearbox, clutch, headlights, aircon, radiator, basically lots of spares or extra goodies you can probably resell to make some money back

Completely agreed. Unfortunately due to space constraints i couldn't take that path.

 

[FiEND]

I'm about to go through the same thing, but with an auto RVR 4G63T into a Manual RVR 4G63. You will need to remove the spigot bearing from the crank, and get some proper 4G63 flywheel bolts.

Reviving an old thread as i've just started on the conversion .. just curious if you we're able to source flywheel and how much it cost.

Anybody who might know where to source a 4g63t flywheel (to suit cc lancer gbox ) may chime in if they wish to .

Thanks in advance .

 

[EVO-00X]

See your other thread Fiend