Built 93T is finished, help me crank her over!

[VIN18M]

Still having no luck with this thing guys, we re set the timing again on the motor yesterday and I am 100% confident that we are definitely spot on as you can see below...

I tried switching the plug leads around and it was the same as when they were in correctly.

We removed the rocker cover and checked the cams were in correctly - all good.

Thought we had the CAS in upside down but soon learned that it'll only go in one way so was correct to begin with.

Every time we changed something we'd remove, check and clean the plugs before trying again.

We have been trying to start the car using the sequential base map so I tried loading up the batch injection base map just to see what happens (I always thought my car ran sequential injection??) and it actually improved things slightly as all plugs were now consistent in colour (although still fowling). When going through the settings on the laptop I realised that the base map for the batch injection was running open loop O2 so I changed it to closed loop and it improved slightly again, although it still won't fire for some reason.

It still seems as though I'm not getting enough spark, but plenty of fuel.

Also, we were getting 20+psi of oil pressure when cranking the engine before, now it's only peaking at about 7-10psi, is it possible we could have killed the oil pump from cranking the motor for so long?

Would running thicker leads increase the amount of spark I'd be getting? I'm running brand new leads but they are only 7mm.

I'm also starting to wonder if there is an issue with the ECU itself, although I think that's highly unlikely as it loads, shows live readings fine and the maps load onto the ECU no problems.

I'm open to suggestions guys as I'm running out of ideas now and really want to at least start the car and check everything before paying for dyno time....

 

[khubner1]

have you checked that the crank timing mark is correct and not 180 out?

 

[VIN18M]

Yep, crank mark is spot on.

Another thing I was thinking was that the ECU may be looking for an AFM, however I've removed this and have a temp sensor running in the intercooler piping? Not sure if the base map is set up to run an AFM?

 

[khubner1]

pretty sure they're airtemp/map. have you set the cas trigger to rising or falling?

 

[VIN18M]

From memory the cas trigger was already set at rising on the base map.

If it's looking for an AFM then I'm chasing my tail really and it'll never run with the base map. I always thought the temp sensor was a replacement for running an AFM and the ecu ran off the MAP/02 sensor/Temp sensor?

 

[khubner1]

Set it to falling I don't suspect it will change much as it's just when the ecu determines a trigger point has occurred but things I've read say ours are best suited to a falling trigger type.

Ie when looking at a square wave (hills and valleys) the ecu sees the voltage change as the trigger

 

[VIN18M]

Hmmm I might try that this weekend and see if it makes any difference.

I was thinking maybe the knock sensor could be interfering with the motor starting also?

 

[ted]

Did you fit a new knock sensor?

 

[4piknup]

Should go wothoit a knock sensor. Factory ecu default to min oct tables for fuel and timing when there is a knock error

 

[VIN18M]

Nah not running a new knock sensor.

I'm thinking of removing the knock sensor this weekend, fitting brand new iridium plugs and giving it a tank of 98 octane with some octane booster to see if that helps it kick over.

I've even tried swapping coilpacks and still don't seem to be getting enough spark for it to fire.

 

[EVOCPE]

So your getting spark and your getting fuel??

keep swapping the leads around, it has to fire

 

[VIN18M]

Previously I was getting a lot more fuel than spark and I think the fuel was actually overloading the plugs so it wouldn't fire.

When I changed to the batch injection map the plugs became a lot more consistent and were still fowling but not coming out wet with fuel on cylinders 1 & 3.

I'm getting the occasional backfire when cranking so fuel is igniting somewhere at some point.

I'm at a loss...

 

[4piknup]

Disco the injectors and squirt some aerostart into the tb. Try that. That will tell you if its sparking well enough to run. If its no better then its a spark issue. If better its a fuel issue.
Could use a squirty bottle with a bit of petrol in it.

Could crank it for a bit, then disco injectors and crank again. If it is flooding, it should catch and run for a bit as the excess pumps out

 

[VIN18M]

Ok, bit of an update on this one.

We checked the oil levels yesterday and realised the engine had about 1 and a half times the amount of oil it should have had in it and thought maybe we had filled the oil with engine on the stands but it still seemed odd. We proceeded to drain some oil and realised we could smell fuel in it, turns out because we had been flooding the engine for so long and haven’t been able to start the engine to bed in the rings, the fuel was draining down through the ring gaps and into the bottom of the motor. Either way the oil is fkd now and probably explains why we've dropped pressure when cranking as it’s very watery.

We put a fresh 20L can of 98 octane in and put in some new irridium plugs in the 6 temp range to see if that helped ignite the fuel, disconnected the knock sensor and reloaded the base map.

Cranked it, still the same.

We removed the plugs again, they were fouled as usual but not wet with fuel like before.

This is basically how it was cranking, sounded healthy but just wouldn’t kick over.


http://s13.photobucket.com/user/vin18m/media/IMG_3742_zps52f31b68.mp4.html?sort=3&o=2



We then tried disconnecting the injectors to see if it would fire off the leftover fuel in the cylinders, no good still.

So we were just about ready to give up on it again for another week but decided to remove the plugs and clean them one more time but try running the plug leads into the coilpack in reverse order. And, it actually significantly improved things. The car was closer to kicking over than ever and actually sounded like it was going to run, but still wouldn’t quite start. We removed the plugs and for the first time they were CLEAN just like they were when we first put them in, except for cylinder 3.

So the issue now was that we didn’t have enough fuel. We swapped the bigger 560cc injectors in and slowly increased injector trim on all cylinders except for cylinder 3.

The car got to the point where it would idle for about a second but wouldn’t keep running. We tried giving it some throttle to see if this would help but throttle made things worse.

It’s progress but I’m not sure we’re any closer to getting the car running.

The plan for next week is new oil and play with injector trims a bit more and see if we can get it to run. For the moment it seems like the fuel pump is giving enough fuel for it to crank but for some reason doesn't keep pumping for it to idle. - this is completely an assumption.

 

[VIN18M]

Ok guys, not getting any further with this and have decided to leave it to the experts.
I've been recommended Unigroup by a friend with a very extreme datto 1200 ute.
Can anyone else recommend someone who tunes Haltechs in Sydney and might be able to sort this for me so I can start driving the thing?

 

[VIN18M]

Ok guys, not getting any further with this and have decided to leave it to the experts.
I've been recommended Unigroup by a friend with a very extreme datto 1200 ute.
Can anyone else recommend someone who tunes Haltechs in Sydney and might be able to sort this for me so I can start driving the thing?

 

[khubner1]

haltech themselves?

 

[Cranked]

Micks Motorsports, he's helped me trouble shoot on a few occasions, even Mark is pretty cluey with it too,

 

[VIN18M]

Thanks mate, will give them a call today and see how I go. Are they pricey?