Evo 1 GSR not starting, odd situation yet similar to countless others.

[Celeb3000]

Will probably do both. This forum has been very helpful. I will start doing the testing tommorow for sure with what jack has outlined, anything updated when I wake up [hitting the hay now] and any other advise like yours.

Appreciate it all, can't say that enough. :thumbsup:

 

[4piknup]

He has power there k.
The fuel pump trigger is fed from the pump wire. The trigger coil must have power cause the pump runs when he manually engages the relay. There is a fault with the ecu or the wire to the ecu.

 

[EVO-00X]

Doesn't have an immobiliser does it? or one that has been removed?
I remember I had a headache on my Mrs old car trying to find the same problem with the fuel pump not working and it ended up being part of a dual or triple point immobiliser, or lack thereof. There was one black wire that was connected to one cut end of the white wire with red trace. The other cut end of the white wire with red trace also had a black wire on it. I worked out that the car used to have an alarm system installed and figured 1 + 1 = Immobiliser! The 2 black wires obviously acted as the switch connection between the cut white wire with red stripe.
Stick your head underneath and follow the white wire with red stripe all the way along the loom to make sure is hasn't been cut or remnants of an alarm system in there somewhere.
Here's a pic of what happened to her car - its worth an easy sanity check at least:

 

[4piknup]

Sure ↑

Here is the diagram. Power feeds in on pin7 (red) out on pin1 (blk/blue). Pin5 is the trigger wire to the ecu.
The ecu is bottom of pic and we can see the (white/red) goes to the ecu on pin8 and is switched to earth on a transistor.
He needs to get a voltmeter and test if there is power on the white/red wire at the ecu and at pin 5 on mfi.

Sorry about the buzzing with the ecu unplugged. I didnt think it would do that.

Even so, it should have run the pump. I think there is a break in that wire as evooox said.

 

[Celeb3000]

2 points.

Immobilizer - it's funny you say that because there are 3-4 wires that are spliced in to various points of the loom that are no longer connected to anything. Pretty much all of them have a quick disconnect tip to them. There are also two clips on the firewall, engine bay side, that are unplugged. I will make progress today and toss some pics up of the clips I am dealing with.

Power wire - Can I just removed the white/red trace from both the relay and from the ecu, then run a brand new wire direct between the two. If it fixes the problem I can run a proper length replacement wire and attach it to follow the loom?

 

[Celeb3000]

I hardwired the white/red wire from the relay directly to the white/red wire from the ecu. Direct 1/2 foot wire bare copper to bare copper and still nothing. I have taken multiple photos to maybe tell if there is a wiring issue. I tried multiple angles and shots.

I keep thinking, what would have happened for it to be instant engine kill on the road. I keep looking for where feet could have snagged wiring or pulled something loose.

 

[Celeb3000]

 

[Celeb3000]

The wiring is horrible. It looks like a rats nest so I hope you can make it out. Once this is fixed, I'm going to remanage it all so it looks nice. I feel kind of bad for this old car which is why I want it fixed.


In the pics. [not in order] [OF NOTE - I do have the relay hooked up when trying to start the car incase anyone wonders why it isn't connected in the pic - and I did move the turbo timer. One pic has it in the ashtray, the others have it sitting on the drivers seat so I could get better wiring pics.]


-Turbo timer wiring [note that at each end of the wiring is disconnected wires]
-Picture to show the hardwiring to the ecu/relay
-Disconnected blue connector in engine bay near washer fluid res.
-Disconnected black connector behind throttle body.
-Pictures of wiring that has been left @ center console
-Main fuse box under steering wheel [not there are some connectors without mates which may be normal.
-A/C actuating arm that clicks and clicks unless I turn the fan on at which point it actuates itself and stops clicking.
-Last picture along with one or two others is the left side of the steering wheel. Another lone wire branched off from a green/silver band wire.

Can do video or pictures easily if requested.

 

[Celeb3000]

I now have an ecu I can borrow - MD193299 - E2T60878. It is out of a 1993 Talon TSI. Worth borrowing to give it a shot?

 

[Celeb3000]

deleted

 

[4piknup]

Those boxes in the last post are all aircon stuff and not related.

I dont think a talon ecu is any good. It will be a 1g with different plugs (not sure)
Or a 2g that I think will plug in but the cas signal is wrong. But it may crank and fire the pump. Not really sure

The 2 plugs on the firewall are the pump test plug and the timing plug. (Brown and black) I think the blue one is for rear washer if you have the second pump on the water bottle
If the pump is running there will be power at the test plug

 

[Celeb3000]

So the blue and black tabs that are unplugged in the engine bay are normally unplugged then I'm assuming [going to delete some of the pics as I knock off what I've been educated on]

 

[4piknup]

Because you have hardwired that pump wire, I think you have a ecu fault.
Have you looked under the cover of the ecu for burnt bits?
Can you still trigger the pump relay by earthing the hardwire? Sso disco the hard wire at the ecu end and earth the hard wire to trigger pump with key on. That should make it run still.

You need to get a volt meter dude. One with diode check to test the ecu. Diode check looks like this ▶l

 

[Celeb3000]

Had to look really close but I think I see now what I missed the first time, the first time I was looking at the tops of the caps. I can clearly see where our issue is probably. Check out the pic........

Also I can trigger the relay doing what you say with the hardwire. Also all wires from the relay with the exception of the solid red, return with 1-3ohm's including our white/red wire.

First pic, right hand side I think says it all.

6

picture....... who wants to bet this is the issue.

 

[4piknup]

In the last pic is ic108. What is the crap on the board next to it? Is it from ic108 or the cap next to it?
If the cap is burst it needs to be replaced and the other cap next to it should be done too.
If it is ic108 that it popped, that is the one that does fuel pump relay. It will need replacing.

Do you have a diode check on a voltmeter yet as I need to measure ic108

 

[4piknup]

Strangely. Looking in my book of notes....
Ic108 is a dual darlington pair device. Basically it is the same as your mfi relay but transistorised. It is 2 relays in a box.
1 side of the relay is to trigger the fuel pump. The other side triggers the a/c relay.
So if ic108 is blown it may infact be because of a fault in the aircon wiring... remember your yucky wiring behind headlight under the bonnet.

The plot thickens....

 

[4piknup]

I see you have a ohm meter now. It needs diode check to work as ohm will not. Looking at ic108, it will be marked with a line and m5269l. The line is closest to pin 1 end of chip.
First pin mentioned has the diode check red lead on it, second has the black. Flip the board over to access the pins
Measure for me.
Pin1-pin8
Pin7-8
Pin4-1
Pin4-7
Pin4-2
Pin4-3
Pin5-3
Pin4-5
Pin4-6
Pin5-6
Pin4-8

Measure them again with the leads reversed and post results.
Also need to measure from ic108 pin1 to ecu pin22 (aircon wire)
And ic108 pin pin7 to ecu pin8 (fuel pump)
This checks the trace from the ecu plug to the ic108

 

[4piknup]

Im not sure what the caps do. But they will work even if leaky. But the crap that comes out is a acid and it eats the board and the metal traces. Your board looks good, and not really affected but if getting your board fixed, get the caps replaced and the sludge cleaned off. Then your board will be good for another 20 years

 

[Celeb3000]

I will need to read this a couple times with everything in front of me.

I have a good friend who used to build circuit boards in the uk before he crossed the pond. He now owns a computer store and does circuit repairs. He has repaired my 3000gt caps in the past so I will take it to him tommorow to repair. I will print your instructions and see if he can help me out with the numbers you are looking for.

This is over my head to be honest. I will attempt to read it a couple times and see if I can make it make sense in my head but i'm not sure exactly how to set up the multimeter at this point.


In response to your question. In the first pic and from my view IC110 looks like the culprit to the area.

VERY interesting about what you said regarding the ac relay fuse. In that case I will attempt a proper fix on that tommorow when I go see my buddy, I will grab appropriate parts rather than how it has been left.

 

[4piknup]

Post pic of multi meter front.
Find a setting that measures pin1 to pin8 with a reading of 0.694 or close. You may have to measure one of the other ic as 108 may be blown maybe ic113

You dint have ic110 fitted. It is the blank holes that is ic110. It is for o2 sensor heater and we dont have that function.
Your first ic is in box ic108. Fuel pump and ac relay.

With the measurements I can tell what part is blown. And if it is the ac part I would advise to pull that wire on the ecu before reinstalling the repaired ecu.

I know it is deep, im trying to make it bearable and explain what is also going on for the othere who may be interested without giving away all my knowledge as well